You’ve written the article I was planning to write! 👌
After 6 months in Portugal, my husband has « won » all the leagues on Duolingo, I’ve read children’s books, listened to podcasts and journaled in the language. Guess who speaks Portuguese?
Bottom line: he wishes he hadn’t wasted 6 months, but he needed the distraction from his demanding job. 😌
I like how someone mentioned « I feel like I’m learning » because that’s absolutely true, but to such a low level of cognitive engagement that you could be learning 10x faster (and better so you can actually use the language).
Great post, thank you! I agree with all your points. It is very easy to go down the road of doing the not-so-demanding exercises with a double XP everyday (like word matches or easy listening practice), stay in the diamond league forever and still learn almost nothing. Jumping levels has been the most useful thing I have been doing on the app, it makes your brain work much more. I have a paid version for this year, but not planning to continue using it afterwards.
Comforting post. I've been gifted a sub and I'm using it to refresh French - really sodding irritating because after a month I'm still working way below my baseline. When Duo rejected my subjunctive as incorrect, I don't know if that's cos French speakers aren't using that these days or cos it wanted me to use its simplified - and to me ungrammatical - version. I'm also starting Scots Gaelic from scratch and mildly surprised to be learning in lesson one that "water is not tasty" and that I can request, "ham and butter, thanks". I'm not even noticing points or leagues cos it's the language nerdery fun that's driving me, but I can see how that would hook people. Still, rather they get hooked on that than bloody candy crush saga or whatever it is that phones offer these days?
Yep. Definitely WAY better than candy crash or other stuff they could get hooked on. The point I think is just being conscious what you're using it for.
This was a great post. I’ve been using Duo since January and I’m currently on a streak of 113 days. I started with Italian and I was doing really really well in my opinion and it was getting harder and harder and harder. But I felt challenged by it and it was something to do besides scrolling IG. And then inexplicably (or so I thought), at a point where I was learning some complicated sentences/phrases and subjunctive tense or whatever, I finished a level, and it suddenly brought me back to a really simple one again. I was so confused. I was pissed actually because I was really getting it and it totally made me lose my momentum by bringing me back down.
Niw I have to think that was my design and that sucks.
I was so bored with it at that point that I switched over to Spanish—I started at the beginning and oh my word, I couldn’t believe how sllloooowwwwlllyyyy it moved along. Like you said, how many times do you have to practice Hola?
I also found that it accepted typos (where Italian never did). And it talked much slower than the Italian. The worst was when you’d have to fill in the blank and the choices would all make sense. Like you could want a watch or a bike or a dress or a car for a gift, but dress was the ‘right’ answer.
I hate the Spanish but I don’t want to go back to the simple Italian. I even had an elevator pitch in Italian that I could speak aloud, and now I’ve lost that.
I was going to recommend Language Transfer for both Italian and Spanish but I have a feeling you might be beyond the basics so might a good time to start consuming simple content like children's cartoons with subtitles (if that's something you think you'd enjoy) or beginner language podcasts, anything that will be slightly above your level but would still be doable.
I had thought about children’s books. After reading your post (and commenting), I decided what the hell and switched back to Italian. I’m now flying through the lessons. The most recent one brought in a whole new slate of vocabulary words that I appear to be getting right simply by chance — or it’s the years I took Latin in high school, ha.
I want to be able to speak Italian though, not just ace some silly game questions.
I’m certainly doing better than I ever did in high school Spanish, but at 120 days, I’m now kind of cynical towards it.
Yeah, I think the trick is to use different resources and switch them up often because there isn't just one that's gonna do it for you. It always takes some effort to keep finding resources that work for you but its worth it.
Thank you for writing about Duolingo! It’s a topic not many explore even though so many of us use it. I hear all your points clearly but I agree with Richard: The language you’re learning matters. Like him, I’ve learned Italian and feel I actually know the basics of the language.
As a native Finn I know Duolingo doesn’t run on the same level as they do with eg. French or Italian. That’s understandable, Finnish is such a tiny language. But then again, I feel like they have a wonderful humor which shows in their translations.
I do feel a bit frustrated with Duolingo sometimes, but then again, it keeps me learning every day. It’s hard to set up a practice when there are so many distractions. I love how it keeps me doing something.
But like you said, we need to do more than just hit Duolingo, and the examples you gave were really good. But I do feel that Duolingo (Super) is worth every penny.
Yes, I think I've just become super conscious about noticing when I'm using technology and when it is using me. With Duolingo I was constantly feeling like they're slowing me down by making me spin in circles. Although you're probably right that the quality of their courses must differ from one language to another.
Thanks for your POV on Duolingo. I found it very interesting. I’m 328 days into learning Spanish on the app, and the first thing I did when I started was to turn off all notifications. There’s no way I would have lasted this long otherwise. While I do feel that I’ve learned quite a bit, I have no idea if the gamification model is more effective than something like Rosetta Stone. My only other point of reference is taking French courses in high school; I’d never tried to learn a language any other way until now. Anyway, again, I appreciate your insight into it.
Honestly, I think Duolingo still beats most in-person courses, just because most in-person courses (that I've tried anyway) are so poorly designed. I haven't tried Rosetta Stone so can't compare. Thank you for reading and taking the time to comment!
Hi. It's been a bit. I've been reading your posts, but have been hesitant to sign up, which one needs to do to comment.
I've played with your idea of learning a whole bunch of languages all at once. When your a retired linguist like me, you have a long trail of languages you once dated. Some only briefly when you were much younger. Latin. Hindi. Some you had a serious relationships with. German. Vietnamese. (Long story there.) Spanish. Ojibwe. (I guess French falls in this category, too.) Then there are those you were set up with. Michif and Plains Cree. Sayula Popoluca. Koine Greek. And those you only flirted with. Cebuano, Tigrinya. Achenese. Japanese.
So DuoLingo, offers an unprecedented opportunity to dive back in. Because my German is passably good, I've long wanted to learn to at least be able to carry out basic conversations in all the major Germanic languages, i.e., Dutch, Swedish (standing in for Norwegian and Danish), and Yiddish. (I remember going to the synagogue of my father's boss, for some reason—we're not Jewish—after coming back from living in Germany in the late 1960s and being blown away by how much Yiddish I just understood.)
Anyway, I've run through several languages on Duolingo and they are wildly different in how good the lessons are. I'm sure it helps that I'm a field linguist and can turn example sentences into understanding the grammar points very quickly. But I'm only about 1/3 of the way through the Dutch course and I can read the posts by my Dutch friends on FB mostly without even consulting a dictionary at all.
Yeah. I'm a linguist. But it's good for me because my conscious processing is so far ahead of my unconscious processing that all their hooks to make you play more, helps me be patient building the listening skills.
Hi Richard!! Good to see you here, I hope you're well :)) I agree that the quality of their courses probably differs depending on their language. I tried three: Zulu, Modern Standard Arabic and Zulu, and was dissatisfied with all of them. I'm mostly frustrated because with their reach they could do truly amazing things, they could leverage the ability of the human brain to learn in a way that no one has done before, but they chose to prioritize profit.
I hear you on the conscious vs. unconscious processing, and I have the same problem as you can imagine. It's hard for me to resist the urge to analyze everything as I go along.
You’ve written the article I was planning to write! 👌
After 6 months in Portugal, my husband has « won » all the leagues on Duolingo, I’ve read children’s books, listened to podcasts and journaled in the language. Guess who speaks Portuguese?
Bottom line: he wishes he hadn’t wasted 6 months, but he needed the distraction from his demanding job. 😌
I like how someone mentioned « I feel like I’m learning » because that’s absolutely true, but to such a low level of cognitive engagement that you could be learning 10x faster (and better so you can actually use the language).
Exactly.
Thanks for this advice!
I used Duolingo to learn some languages a few times (first i used it to practice French, then for German, and lastly, Finnish).
The reason i stopped using it was its gatekeeping purpose, preventing you from leveling-up.
Its all true *sobs.
But its a start (4 year streak).
Great post, thank you! I agree with all your points. It is very easy to go down the road of doing the not-so-demanding exercises with a double XP everyday (like word matches or easy listening practice), stay in the diamond league forever and still learn almost nothing. Jumping levels has been the most useful thing I have been doing on the app, it makes your brain work much more. I have a paid version for this year, but not planning to continue using it afterwards.
Yea, what’s with getting into the diamond league and that’s it?
Comforting post. I've been gifted a sub and I'm using it to refresh French - really sodding irritating because after a month I'm still working way below my baseline. When Duo rejected my subjunctive as incorrect, I don't know if that's cos French speakers aren't using that these days or cos it wanted me to use its simplified - and to me ungrammatical - version. I'm also starting Scots Gaelic from scratch and mildly surprised to be learning in lesson one that "water is not tasty" and that I can request, "ham and butter, thanks". I'm not even noticing points or leagues cos it's the language nerdery fun that's driving me, but I can see how that would hook people. Still, rather they get hooked on that than bloody candy crush saga or whatever it is that phones offer these days?
Yep. Definitely WAY better than candy crash or other stuff they could get hooked on. The point I think is just being conscious what you're using it for.
This was a great post. I’ve been using Duo since January and I’m currently on a streak of 113 days. I started with Italian and I was doing really really well in my opinion and it was getting harder and harder and harder. But I felt challenged by it and it was something to do besides scrolling IG. And then inexplicably (or so I thought), at a point where I was learning some complicated sentences/phrases and subjunctive tense or whatever, I finished a level, and it suddenly brought me back to a really simple one again. I was so confused. I was pissed actually because I was really getting it and it totally made me lose my momentum by bringing me back down.
Niw I have to think that was my design and that sucks.
I was so bored with it at that point that I switched over to Spanish—I started at the beginning and oh my word, I couldn’t believe how sllloooowwwwlllyyyy it moved along. Like you said, how many times do you have to practice Hola?
I also found that it accepted typos (where Italian never did). And it talked much slower than the Italian. The worst was when you’d have to fill in the blank and the choices would all make sense. Like you could want a watch or a bike or a dress or a car for a gift, but dress was the ‘right’ answer.
I hate the Spanish but I don’t want to go back to the simple Italian. I even had an elevator pitch in Italian that I could speak aloud, and now I’ve lost that.
I was going to recommend Language Transfer for both Italian and Spanish but I have a feeling you might be beyond the basics so might a good time to start consuming simple content like children's cartoons with subtitles (if that's something you think you'd enjoy) or beginner language podcasts, anything that will be slightly above your level but would still be doable.
I had thought about children’s books. After reading your post (and commenting), I decided what the hell and switched back to Italian. I’m now flying through the lessons. The most recent one brought in a whole new slate of vocabulary words that I appear to be getting right simply by chance — or it’s the years I took Latin in high school, ha.
I want to be able to speak Italian though, not just ace some silly game questions.
I’m certainly doing better than I ever did in high school Spanish, but at 120 days, I’m now kind of cynical towards it.
Yeah, I think the trick is to use different resources and switch them up often because there isn't just one that's gonna do it for you. It always takes some effort to keep finding resources that work for you but its worth it.
This is great advice — thank you!
Thank you for writing about Duolingo! It’s a topic not many explore even though so many of us use it. I hear all your points clearly but I agree with Richard: The language you’re learning matters. Like him, I’ve learned Italian and feel I actually know the basics of the language.
As a native Finn I know Duolingo doesn’t run on the same level as they do with eg. French or Italian. That’s understandable, Finnish is such a tiny language. But then again, I feel like they have a wonderful humor which shows in their translations.
I do feel a bit frustrated with Duolingo sometimes, but then again, it keeps me learning every day. It’s hard to set up a practice when there are so many distractions. I love how it keeps me doing something.
But like you said, we need to do more than just hit Duolingo, and the examples you gave were really good. But I do feel that Duolingo (Super) is worth every penny.
Yes, I think I've just become super conscious about noticing when I'm using technology and when it is using me. With Duolingo I was constantly feeling like they're slowing me down by making me spin in circles. Although you're probably right that the quality of their courses must differ from one language to another.
Thanks for your POV on Duolingo. I found it very interesting. I’m 328 days into learning Spanish on the app, and the first thing I did when I started was to turn off all notifications. There’s no way I would have lasted this long otherwise. While I do feel that I’ve learned quite a bit, I have no idea if the gamification model is more effective than something like Rosetta Stone. My only other point of reference is taking French courses in high school; I’d never tried to learn a language any other way until now. Anyway, again, I appreciate your insight into it.
Honestly, I think Duolingo still beats most in-person courses, just because most in-person courses (that I've tried anyway) are so poorly designed. I haven't tried Rosetta Stone so can't compare. Thank you for reading and taking the time to comment!
Oh my, figuring out I could shut off those damn chimes was amazing!
Life-changing, isn’t it?
Hi. It's been a bit. I've been reading your posts, but have been hesitant to sign up, which one needs to do to comment.
I've played with your idea of learning a whole bunch of languages all at once. When your a retired linguist like me, you have a long trail of languages you once dated. Some only briefly when you were much younger. Latin. Hindi. Some you had a serious relationships with. German. Vietnamese. (Long story there.) Spanish. Ojibwe. (I guess French falls in this category, too.) Then there are those you were set up with. Michif and Plains Cree. Sayula Popoluca. Koine Greek. And those you only flirted with. Cebuano, Tigrinya. Achenese. Japanese.
So DuoLingo, offers an unprecedented opportunity to dive back in. Because my German is passably good, I've long wanted to learn to at least be able to carry out basic conversations in all the major Germanic languages, i.e., Dutch, Swedish (standing in for Norwegian and Danish), and Yiddish. (I remember going to the synagogue of my father's boss, for some reason—we're not Jewish—after coming back from living in Germany in the late 1960s and being blown away by how much Yiddish I just understood.)
Anyway, I've run through several languages on Duolingo and they are wildly different in how good the lessons are. I'm sure it helps that I'm a field linguist and can turn example sentences into understanding the grammar points very quickly. But I'm only about 1/3 of the way through the Dutch course and I can read the posts by my Dutch friends on FB mostly without even consulting a dictionary at all.
Yeah. I'm a linguist. But it's good for me because my conscious processing is so far ahead of my unconscious processing that all their hooks to make you play more, helps me be patient building the listening skills.
Just my two cents.
Hi Richard!! Good to see you here, I hope you're well :)) I agree that the quality of their courses probably differs depending on their language. I tried three: Zulu, Modern Standard Arabic and Zulu, and was dissatisfied with all of them. I'm mostly frustrated because with their reach they could do truly amazing things, they could leverage the ability of the human brain to learn in a way that no one has done before, but they chose to prioritize profit.
I hear you on the conscious vs. unconscious processing, and I have the same problem as you can imagine. It's hard for me to resist the urge to analyze everything as I go along.
Thank you for reading and commenting!